Wednesday, November 12, 2014

How Bad Does a Celebrity Have to Be to Lose Your Support?

Stephen Collins' career was completely derailed recently when a tape was released of him admitting to child molestation. He even claims the tape has destroyed all future earning potential.



But will he never be able to work again? Not necessarily. In fact, the public has shown that just about anything is forgivable, especially if you have the power to avoid it ever going to court.

First there's Woody Allen, who married his live-in girlfriend's adopted daughter (age 19). In the early 90s, there were allegations that he'd abused his seven-year-old adopted daughter Dylan, which Dylan herself confirmed in an open letter published earlier this year. Despite the scandal, Allen continues to prevail, winning four Oscars, two Golden Globes, and numerous awards and accolades over the course of his career. The 19-year-old he fell in love with and later married? They're still married today.



Then there's Bill Cosby, accused of raping 14 separate women--in some instances after drugging them. He paid to make the allegations go away back in 2006, but with a little help from a comedian and Twitter, it's all coming back on him. But despite all the bad publicity in 2006, Cosby has been honored with awards and multiple degrees over the years and is currently staging a comeback. In addition to being cast in a 2015 NBC TV show, he's in the middle of his own comedy tour called Far From Finished.



Sean Connery once famously told Barbara Walters it's okay to slap a woman, as long as you've tried everything else and she still won't shut her yapper. Since originally saying that in the 60s and confirming it with Barbara Walters in the 80s, women (and men) have packed theaters to admire the guy's work. 



Mel Gibson...is just a mess. Yet still he makes money. He's no superstar, but he's doing just as well as all the other actors who peaked in the 90s in spite of racist rants and alleged girlfriend-beating.




I think we all know that with a lot of cash and a great PR firm, celebrities can make just about anything go away. But do we, as the viewing public, have an obligation to not let them get away with that? After all, movie studios will only keep giving them work as long as we keep paying to see it. Or is it "innocent until proven guilty," even if the celebrity pulls some strings to make sure no trial ever happens?

118 comments:

  1. I think the public is fairly forgiving. Don't make what they do right, just means the public forgives and forgets. It's a shame when they should go to trial and don't though. Or there are no consequences. I think athletes who behave badly annoy me more. They can do anything they want off the field, but as long as they perform on the field, they can get away with anything. If I did drugs, abused women, and got DWI's, my company would fire me.

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    1. With athletes, it's always been about money. Schools make sure star athletes get passing grades so they'll keep winning games. I assume it's the same with movies. As long as we'll watch Bill Cosby's new TV show and pack auditoriums to see his routines, he has a career. In general, there is an inequity in what rich people can get away with. Hire a Johnny Cochran for that DWI case, and he'll find some way to get the entire case dropped.

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  2. It is unbelievable what people can get away with but if they don't go to trial we have no recourse other than boycotting them. I've been known to do this but more people need to do it to show people they cannot get away with these things. I am grateful I am not a star though, I wouldn't want to live in that fish bowl life...

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    1. I have to be honest--I was sitting here reading about Bill Cosby Sunday and I just could not reconcile what I was reading with the nice man on the screen. I think that's a large part of it. We didn't see it, so it's really hard to believe it.

      After seeing Sean Connery say that 10 years ago, I can't even watch him. The sight of him sickens me. I'd always heard he said it, but when I saw it with my own two eyes, that was the end of it. I know he's from a different country/era, but keep your thoughts to yourself, dude. Especially when millions of female fans have helped pay for that fancy life you've lived.

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  3. It's sad that celebrity status can allow people to get away with this. I never knew that about Sean Connery. I used to love him as an actor, but I won't look at him the same anymore.

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    1. I used to love Mel Gibson until the crazy came out. It's a shame, too--he always seemed like such a fun, easygoing guy when he was interviewed on film sets in the 90s.

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  4. I actually didn't know about Bill Cosby (I thought it was more like a few sexual harassment charges). That makes me sad, as I've always liked him. I'm not sure that the public is forgiving; I think it's more like the public will watch anything and they especially enjoy watching train wrecks (think shows like Honey BooBoo).

    Great topic!

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    1. I thought it was just sexual harassment, too. When you google his name and the word rape, all the details come up. Women came forward to legit. publications and gave their names, wanting nothing in return for giving their stories. Since he settled, I guess it's over and done...there's also a statute of limitations, like with Stephen Collins. At least this time it's getting exposure so people will know to stay away from these guys.

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  5. We do have to forgive, but we don't have to support their work. I won't be paying to see or read the work of these who have abused others. As long as the money is rolling in, people will see no need to change!

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    1. I do think there should be repercussions. It's tough because in some of these cases, there's no way to know for 100% certain that anything occurred--even when they're tried and convicted, there's no way to know for 100% certain. Only they know for sure. But there are so many rich, powerful people who get away with things they shouldn't be allowed to get away with...if you have faith, you know someday they'll be answerable to a higher power. If not, I guess you can just hope karma bites them in the butt!

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  6. Sister, you forgot Morgan Freeman who slept with his adopted granddaughter! Or Meg Ryan who left her loving husband and kids for that idiotic Russell Crowe and than her career went downhill, deservedly :)
    I generally don't like to overly judge them before I examine all the evidence, because I often have a feeling that the public likes to trash them mercilessly even when the case isn't black and white (Chris Brown for example).

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    1. Oh--if we went into the many celebrities who cheated on/left their spouses, we'd be here all day! In fact, the # of celebs who were faithful for their entire marriages is so small, we'd have no movies or TV shows to see if we boycotted them. Men can cheat and leave their wives and it doesn't even make a dent but LeAnn Rimes, Amy Grant, Meg Ryan...that's it. They are branded with a scarlet letter. I find it very fascinating because we all do it to them. In fact, women are probably harsher toward each other than men ever could be. Unless you're Angelina Jolie. Angelina got away with man-snatching--in fact, somehow she ended up coming out MORE well-liked afterward. Maybe women just need to be more kick-butt like her!

      I didn't know that about Morgan Freeman. I didn't know about Bill Cosby until this week, though...I think many of us simply miss the newsflash and go on with our lives completely unknowing.

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    2. quit lying Dezmond!!! Meg Ryan did not leave her son or ex husband. HE, Quaid, cheated on her for many years before she took their son and left him. Only after they seperated, did she become involved with Crowe.

      You need to read less gossipmagazines.

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    3. and yes, Stephanie, we as women should quit being so judgemental about other women. Its funny how women always assume when a man cheats, it's still the womans fault. It's not of course. And yes, it is ridiculous how women are burned far worse than a man who cheates over and over again. Meg Ryan is a great example of the media and public gone crazy. She was cheated on by Quaid for years and years and nobody cared. Then she left him and had a revenge fling with someone hotter and younger and all of a sudden she was a bad person. I can't stand Quaid and the way he has never publicly confessed to his years and years of cheating, instead let the mohter of his then onyl chilc take the blame. It makes him a really really bad father. And needless to say, he has also cheated for years on his current wife, and once again the media/public lets him get away with it. Shame really.

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    4. @Anonymous
      is that you,Meg?

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    5. LOL, Dezmond. CLASSIC! It wouldn't surprise me. But I think the fact that we hold Meg Ryan more accountable just means that we expected more of her than we do most actors and actresses. She was America's sweetheart--we expected her to be perfect.

      I think the nature of the entertainment business--on movie shoots for months at a time where you're paid to kiss beautiful members of the opposite sex, etc.--is just conducive to cheating. Not that it's any excuse...but as someone said in another comment, power corrupts. "Mo money, mo problems!" (Yes, I just quoted The Notorious B.I.G.!) Now I'll quote Bill Murray: "I always want to say to people who want to be rich and famous: 'try being rich first'. See if that doesn't cover most of it."

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  7. I've heard it said that if you have enough money, you can get away with anything--even murder. I like to think Karma eventually catches up with these guys (and gals). Maybe it’s true. After all, OJ wasn’t found “innocent,” he was found not guilty, but he is finally in prison. I saw the Sean Connery interview in the 80s and feel the same as you do. I won’t watch him in anything. Same with Woody Allen, I’ve always thought he was a sleazebag and could never watch his movies. He is just gross. Mel Gibson is also off my “to watch” list and I used to really like him. I was very surprised by the Bill Cosby thing. I’ve always liked him. I’ll be giving him a pass from now on too. I guess I’ll just stick with my books.

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    1. Yeah, Mel Gibson and Bill Cosby were disappointments, but I never cared for Woody Allen or Sean Connery, so no loss. Maybe it's surprising to us when we realize we never sensed anything astray with Bill Cosby. We just can't accept it because we feel disappointed in ourselves that our creep-meters didn't go off. There are people out there vehemently defending Bill Cosby and pointing out that women make up rape accusations all the time. So sad that rape victims have to deal with that attitude.

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  8. Well, I still haven't forgiven Woody Allen. Can't/won't watch his movies. Can't say I ever heard of the Bill Cosby stuff before. Gah. But, yeah, a lot of it does get forgiven and overlooked, though not always. Sometimes it depends on the believability of the person's "mea culpa".

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    1. It's interesting that it forced Roman Polanski into hiding...he wasn't above the law except for being able to escape actual jail time by leaving the country. I still strongly suspect Robert Wagner killed Natalie Wood and he will die without ever being charged for it. I'd like to believe people are more answerable for crimes today than they were back in the mid- to late-1900s, but if you watch Dateline for any amount of time, you start to realize it's a little scary how many people get away with murder because of insufficient evidence.

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  9. it's a tough call. i don't think we have a right to judge someone as guilty just from what is reported in magazines and webzines. but, as you said, if they have the strings to pull to keep it out of court, a 'truth' may never surface and it remains all speculation.

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    1. I think in many cases, not just celebs, people get away with crimes due to having really good attorneys. There are also a lot of technicalities that get people out of being convicted. Public shunning has always been a way to get justice when people know someone has gotten away with a crime (think Lizzie Borden)--but you never really know for sure, even when someone is convicted. There are innocent people sitting on death row right this very moment who will likely die without people ever knowing the truth, just as there are guilty people walking around in public, having gotten away with the crime. I just hope the people mentioned in this blog aren't able to hurt anyone else...the truly guilty ones, anyway...

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  10. I have too also heard that the public is forgiving, especially if the person who did the wrong admits to the wrong and asks for forgiveness and then in turn "turns a new leaf" so to speak. A lot of people are against Michael Vick and he did a terrible thing with the dog fighting, but he served his punishment, did what was expected of him, etc. God forgives us, I should forgive others. Now I can choose whether I want to support them by watching movies, games, etc., but I do think we need to forgive :)

    betty

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    1. Isn't it funny that people hold Michael Vick more accountable than Bill Cosby? I do think Stephen Collins will suffer greatly, career-wise, mostly because children were involved. I think Woody Allen has had to deal with some shunning from the public over the years, too. Crimes against children seem to be especially unforgivable...

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  11. And I'm reminded why I've never gotten into celebrity worship. =) There are actually very few actors I "like," and some I can't watch or listen to anymore because of the things I've learned about them. Society overall seems to have a short memory, but again, that's probably thanks to the way media is spun but silver-tongue assistance. *sigh* And that's why I don't trust news stations either.

    Unleashing the Dreamworld

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    1. And what's a little scary is that we don't even know the half of what goes on in Hollywood! There are secrets that are buried pretty deep in the entertainment industry. We might hear whispers every now and then--but mostly it's about silly things like who is secretly gay or having an affair. The murders and really dark stuff usually stay tucked away.

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  12. It sickens me to see what these celebrities maggots have done that is so wrong. Don't they have any morality at all?.. Having celebrity status and a lot of money and prestige seems not to be enough for these guys.
    From what I can read on the covers of magazines at the cash register, not many of them are really who they are portrait to be. They're all pretty well a mess. Money and celebrity and power corrupts. It's just the way it is and I've never been a great fan of the stars. I love the stars in the sky at night... Those are my super stars...

    The public has gotten indifferent and it's OK as long as it doesn't affect them too close to home it seems. I wonder how Barbie and Ken have kept themselves clean.
    Hugs,
    JB

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    1. Power corrupts. It's a chicken and egg thing--the type of narcissistic personality that causes someone to feed off of fame and power can also lead them to do things without guilt. Most of us have no desire to be famous...and we might want to have a little more money, but not crazy money like these people have. I think fame is more a curse than a blessing.

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  13. All of this made me cringe. I definitely don't think celebrities should get off the hook, or slaps on the wrist, for committing a crime -especially one against children. I do think they have the right to "innocent until proven guilty" but as part of that there should be a trial. I never knew that about Sean Connery, which is disappointing because I did like him as an actor.

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    1. At least with Sean Connery, Mel Gibson, and Stephen Collins, there's evidence. They'll never face jail time for their behavior (except for whatever little time Mel Gibson spent behind bars) and there's no way to ever know for sure what they did. But even a trial doesn't guarantee someone's really guilty. I've seen many trials on TV where someone ws found guilty because of the jury's judgment...while others, like OJ, ended without a conviction because there just wasn't enough proof, not because they were proven innocent. Sometimes I guess we have to just know that they'll someday have to face a higher power for what they did to harm others. Both children and rape victims are impacted for life by the damage done to them. I'm not sure these nuts realize that.

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  14. I think celebrities are nuts. I don't support most of them. So, I'm the exception I guess. Anyone that can pay their way out of scandal I'm not going to support.

    Have a fabulous day. ☺

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    1. Hollyweird. That's why they call it that! I'm pretty sure we only hear about 10% of the craziness that's really going on. Allegedly Bill Cosby consistently harassed young actresses on the set of his show--none of them spoke out about it. That stuff happens all the time.

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  15. The more money a person has, the more things they can get away with. I don't respect many celebrities anyway because they are all a bunch of babies. i mean when you have to have something as simply as a bottle of water brought to you, instead of taking a few steps to get it yourself, you deserve no respect. Gibson is obviously a racist sob, but in those tapings he was clearly egged on so she could get more money in the divorce. Sometimes they just have nut jobs making up stories to try and sue too, but most times not. Still pffft to them all, 95% of them are just nuts.

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    1. Mel Gibson's issues started when he spouted off about Jewish people to those cops--I personally lost interest in him at that exact moment. I think his wife probably wound him up during those calls, but he made a LOT of racist statements. Aside from him allegedly hitting her while she was holding their baby, I think his racist colors kind of showed through on that call. But I started losing respect for him when I heard that he refused to use birth control or let his wife work because of his religion. So she's over there in Australia raising his 900 children, which is fine if that's the life she wants--but THEN there would be all these pictures of him, drunk, with his arms draped around beautiful women... The religion part of it kind of confused me there. Maybe his wife was fine with all that, but I just couldn't wrap my head around him creating all these children and leaving her to raise them alone while he partied over here in America.

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  16. Let's see, who's guilty "enough" in my mind of various charges, so that I've turned against them, and wouldn't spend a cent toward supporting them? Mel Gibson, Mike Tyson, O.J. Simpson? No matter how bad the evidence is against others -- Robert Blake, for example -- I'm not dismissing their work. Phil Spector, for instance. Total loony, but he did release some great music during his career.

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    1. To clarify, I was saying I would/will NOT support Mel Gibson, Mike Tyson, or O.J. Simpson! The others I mentioned... Those are different.

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    2. Is it weird that it's different with musicians? Maybe because we don't have to look at them. It's one thing to listen to a song...but when you're trying to buy Mel Gibson as a softhearted husband, you just keep thinking about all the news stories, if that makes sense? It's why so many Hollywood megastars still hide their true sexuality, which I think is ridiculous in this day and age. They're actors, but once you know a little more about them, you start to see them differently. I think the sexuality thing is irrelevant because who cares? But hitting women or doing things to children... I mean, how could we watch Stephen Collins playing a dad again without cringing???

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    3. Referring to women being judged more harshly than men by society -- and I agree that they are, unjustly so -- that may explain why Angelina Jolie, who "stole" Brad from Jen, is being mentioned by commenters here alongside males who are rapists, spouse abusers (physical and emotional), child molesters, and racists?

      Anyway, congratulations on providing a forum for an extremely thought-provoking issue, Stephanie!

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  17. Cosby was a bad guy? I'm crushed. I love him. Say it's all lies Stephanie! I'm a bit sad now :(

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    1. Well...there are people who say it's a lie...but the stories come from many different women and they kind of sound credible. They're a little hard to read. I didn't read them until I was writing this yesterday...and the whole thing just made me mad. I guess he roofied them? The drug he used wasn't specified.

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  18. A very deep post here. A crime is a crime. Celebrity or not, all should go through the same process.

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    1. I think so, too, but in the course of responding to comments today, I've started to think about that. I watch a lot of Dateline and I can't tell you how many instances people have been convicted OR acquitted and you don't know for sure if it was the right choice. Often it's a matter of, "Is there enough evidence?" but there's no way to know 100% without a confession that someone actually did (or didn't do) what they're accused of. We live in a time where, unless you live in a small town, you can be acquitted of murdering someone, move, and nobody will ever know. It's a little scary when you think about it.

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  19. I absolutely believe in the power of PR--and of course time. Those PR firms, work magic. But I for one, never forget. Rihanna last year put a young fan in a position to be mocked and ridiculed (reposting a side-by-side photo on Instagram) all because Rihanna didn't appreciate the girl for making a prom dress that looked like one she'd worn. The girl was crushed to say the least. I've stopped supporting Rihanna's music after that. I don't want to support someone who has no regard for other people, or think themselves above others. There's better ways I can spend my money or my time than to support that kind of business. Very thought-provoking post. I like it! :)

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    1. I saw that. That was awful! The bat wing dress? I love the way Taylor Swift treats her fans--she recently photo-bombed two young girls getting their photos taken at a Nashville park. SO sweet!

      As for PR--the meme disaster is proof that PR firms don't have as much power as they once did. His PR people posted an invitation on Twitter Monday for everyone to meme a picture of him. Each meme had to be approved, but people know how to make memes! The hashtag they'd created exploded with memes of Bill Cosby like the one in the blog...they soon took the meme-maker down, but the damage had been done. By the end, I'm guessing an extra few thousand people knew about the rape allegations who didn't know last week. That doesn't include the fact that the whole incident ended up making news, spreading the word even further! PR is tough in a social media world...consumers tend to be able to speak louder than the PR people!

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  20. Well, there's Adam Richman, who got tossed out with the trash for misusing a twitter hashtag. (He thought "thinspiration" was about weight loss, not about about promoting eating disorders, allegedly.)
    Then there's the whole Paula Deen, who admitted under oath to saying something bad long ago, back when it wasn't socially considered as bad as it is now.

    So maybe it's all about being replaceable. Or if the public likes you more than they hate you.

    I don't know if it's all that different for celebrities, or if we just notice it more because it's OUT THERE.

    I've got an Uncle we should lynch mob. Seriously, grab your torch and pitchfork. He'd not famous though. And his crimes, while as bad or nearly as bad as most of the ones in this post, just get swept under the rug. Tried to kill your daughter and her boyfriend? Well... as long as you bought the coffee and donuts later, we can let it slide.

    I don't know.

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    1. So sorry to hear that about your uncle. Seems every family has that one black sheep...but attempted murder is a little tougher than most! Yeah, people aren't too forgiving of Paula Deen...and Martha Stewart appears to have been unable to outrun her reputation, although she does well as a businesswoman with all of her home merchandise.

      I had to look up the Adam Richman thing. The hashtag was bad...but telling someone to go kill themselves? Wow. I have to say, after the recent craziness over Bill Cosby, Queen Latifah canceled his appearance on her show. That made me respect Queen Latifah even more than I already did!

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  21. I used to love Mel Gibson. And then I realized he was mean. If you're a mean person, no thanks.

    Stephen Collins. Eek. I enjoyed 7th Heaven but I'm not sure if I could watch it now.

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    1. They pulled it--I don't think it's airing anywhere anymore. Something like 2 hours after the story broke, he was dropped from a movie called Ted 2, they pulled 7th Heaven, and he was dropped from Scandal (he was supposed to have a part in an episode this season).

      As to Mel Gibson--mean. That's definitely it! When they interviewed him on set in the 90s, he always seemed so friendly and approachable. But dude has some anger issues. Plus, all that drinking and "carousing" (the word he used for it) in the 80s and 90s appears to have caught up with him. He looks awful!

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  22. The public is forgiving. Nicholas Brenden, Xander from Buffy the Vampire Slayer, came to our comic con last month, and then got arrested for drunk and disorderly. It made the news. Still, he was there the next day, and even gave out hugs.

    I didn't know about Cosby or Collins. I think Woody Allen was before my time to really care. Connery... I think that was the attitude back in the day. Probably would get a lot more heat if a younger actor came forward with that view.

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    1. I saw that about Nicolas Brendan. By the way, I'm watching Buffy now! Just finished season 2. I don't know why I didn't watch it the first time. I'm sorry to say it, but he was arrested for not staying seated when he was ordered to--and I immediately wondered if he wasn't just dealing with a cop on a power trip who refused to see that he was trying to smooth things over. Of course, it could be that he was pulling the celebrity card. Reese Witherspoon tried to pull that same crap on cops last year. "Do you KNOW who I am? I'm SOMEBODY, darn it! I have fans." That sort of thing. I'm guessing if you're a celebrity, letting cops know "who you are" sometimes gets you out of tickets... But when it doesn't, it can severely backfire.

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  23. The one thing that will make me boycott a celebrity is proven animal abuse. Michael Vick was proven to have dog fights but the NFL took him back and let him play which in my opinion should never have happened. I blast him on Twitter every chance I get when I see people are praising him for something.

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    1. People still praise them? They're praising Bill Cosby...they praised O.J. I guess nothing should surprise me!

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  24. There are some crimes which I think are unforgiveable. It doesn't matter who commits them, celebrity or not. And child abuse/molestation falls firmly into that camp for me.
    Actors and sporting stars get away with a great deal which I don't think they should. And there are some who I will boycott. Permanently. Fame, like money, doesn't excuse bad behaviour.

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  25. Crimes against children or animals are enough to turn me away from a celebrity.

    It's disgusting how forgiving we are because of a person's celebrity, but we hold grudges against people we know for committing the same crime.

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    1. That is true. 100 years ago, someone would be shunned in the community but now cities are so big and people are so disconnected, many have no idea that they live next door to an ax murderer.

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  26. I think people have a fascination with fame--whether it's for good deeds or evil acts. Famous people have a way of getting what they want.

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    1. Celebrities and sports stars are America's royalty. Britain thinks royal divorces are scandal, though. They have no idea!

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  27. I think people have difficulty determining what is media hype and what is fact. True we do forgive.

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    1. They do. In Stephen Collins' and Mel Gibson's cases, there was audiotape that kind of made it hard to deny. We can SEE Sean Connery seeing it. But it's hard to reconcile what we're reading about Bill Cosby and the man we see on TV.

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  28. Did Blogger just eat my comment? Sigh.

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    1. I think so. I commented someone's blog today that I know I commented last week...I was worried I was just missing the comment but I couldn't find it anywhere!

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  29. Human beings have very short memories and love to forgive a "good" guy. back in the day, the big studios hid the fact that Clark Gable had a hit and run and Errol Flynn gave new meaning and coined the term "in like Flynn" . I did not know about Bill Cosby. I watched that interview with Barbara Walters and my mouth dropped but James Bond slapped women around and then the idiots asked for more so it seemed "fine". I had read that Morgan Freeman, who was married for many years, left her for his step grand daughter...ick!!!! He probably bounced her on his knee (and still does-double ick). Halle Berry had 2 hit and runs and the first boy was killed and the other was paid off and she claims no memory. There are also so many sports figures( Mike Tyson) who have raped and beaten women and we see qactual proof but they get away with it. Why? Money! They bring in the money so all the lawyers are hired and all the people to do damage control are hired and then they show women who would love to be with them even after all of this. What can one say?? They do so much damage to cars, buildings, people, animals, friends and family and themselves and they get away with it. If it was us, we would be locked up. Look how much Michael jackson is revered yet he had a secret room filled with pictures of young boys and he paid off families but we believe him because...why??? Now that pic of Woody with his wife made me snicker-she does not look like a happy camper does she? If I were Woody i would be scared

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    1. I didn't know that about Clark Gable! You could hide things like that back then. The PR people pretty much ran the media (in Hollywood, anyway). Now, thanks to TMZ, you can't hide anything! To our credit, though, Michael Jackson was really only revered before all that was revealed. His career was pretty much destroyed when he died...there was a brief "king of pop" tribute period, but without all that stuff about child molestation, he probably would have ranked up there close to Elvis as one of the best musicians of all time. (My husband always points out that Elvis was kind of washed up when he died--fat, playing in Vegas, etc--but he died and people lost their minds!)

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  30. In this whole "cult of personality" society, I think that it is fine - and necessary - to pull away from some of these clowns.

    That said...

    I also know that the public will NEVER know the real story behind the news story and many, many (did I say many?) will take advantage of things that look bad, are bad or are absolutely nothing if it promotes an agenda. Bad behavior and agendas are neck and neck in the race for headlines.

    Since I don't need celebrity worship to survive, I'm more than happy to turn my attentions to some other schmuck.

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    1. Cult of Personality--is THAT what that song was about? I'm going to have to Google the lyrics. I never got what they were singing about.

      I think people feed off of gossip mostly because it's a way of connecting with our fellow humans. But that's what fascinates me...the media loves to report this stuff and people eat it up--so how is it that 14 women can accuse a beloved TV star of rape and the vast majority of the population never knows about it? From what I'm reading, it sounds like it was reported but very minimally. I think the most fascinating thing about all of this for me is that PR people are still powerful enough to suppress news like they do.

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    2. Once upon a time, I learned a lesson. We had a crazy, trashy lady and her kids in our neighborhood. Her 11 yr. old son attacked my 18 month old son (in diapers, no less, barely walking) and she sued ME. Literally, her crazy kid who had been asked to leave three times knocked him down and laughed. Toddler son was laying on the ground and as he tried to get up, he picked up a stick in the track of the sliding glass door. The crazy kid tried to swing at him again (amused by his pain) and the kid banged his head on the stick - no joke, this was witnessed by three people who were running over to stop this kid. The kid had a half inch scratch.

      That same day, instead of apologizing - she asked me how much money I made. She sued me. I got a lawyer and told him the details: Older kid, developmentally delayed baby, asked to leave multiple times, the babysitters (twins) had gone to the Mom's house to get her to intercede. She wouldn't - she said she was tired. And then attacking this toddler. She also said that her kid went by ambulance to ER and was psychologically traumatized - all untrue and easily disproved.

      The lawyer told me that people can say or sue for any reason, and they frequently fabricate the entire ridiculous story. I reminded him that I was a single parent at that time - I didn't have money. He said she was probably banking on insurance. This lady did it often, because it got her money. Frequently, people just pay to shut her up and avoid the risk of actually losing.

      With celebrity, multiply that a zillion times. Lots of monetary potential there. So I try to be neutral till I see something that actually looks real. If so, I leave 'em in the dust.

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    3. How awful! Did the insurance pay? There should be a way to stop these people who make a living off of suing people for bogus things.

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    4. Actually, I proved it was all a lie and made her look ridiculous BUT I did pay $360 dollars for a visit to Ambulatory Care (they did zip...she tried to force a head injury diagnosis). She mocked me and told me she and her pals had a big drinking party with the money. So I told her health insurance company I paid it....which meant thst wad THEIR money. They sued her for it. She paid back $365 plus her own lawyer fees.

      I'm evil. Ha ha.

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    5. You're not evil. That child must have been disturbed. He needed constant, close supervision. And the mom of the babysitters who wouldn't come to help? I feel so sorry for her because she was tired. Boo-hoo.

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  31. I think for the sake of entertainment, viewers necessarily forget for the moment that the person on screen is the person doing evil off screen.

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    1. I think so--especially Bill Cosby. I can't see Mel Gibson or Sean Connery that way anymore. I can't even stand to watch anything Sean Connery is in. I can still watch Mel Gibson from the good old days...I guess I can fool myself into believing Mel's racism and anger came later? Probably not, though.

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  32. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    1. After learning of Woody Allen's personal life has led me to never watch a single one of his movies.

      Others I've ignored have been Kanye West (taylor swift snub), Chris Brown (Rihanna incident), and a few others I've can't remember at the moment.

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    2. I wish I could say I'm boycotting Woody Allen but I never cared for his work, so that was no loss! Kanye West also went a little mental on a telethon following Hurricane Katrina. He has his own agenda and he's not afraid to completely hijack an event to push his opinion on the world.

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    3. Kanye West disgusts me, as does his wife (especially in the wake of her attempt to "break the internet"). I will never deny that he at least has talent, but she has none. Taking selfies and releasing a sex tape proves that she is a talentless hack undeserving of anymore attention.

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  33. Celebrities like this make me so sad -- especially because, like you said, there are so many people who still support them. Maybe that's even sadder. I do think, though, that situations like this are also good reminders of all the wonderful, compassionate celebrities who do amazing things with their platforms. I try hard to focus on those!

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    1. That is true...and what's sad about Bill Cosby is that he HAS done many, many amazing things with his money. In addition to his charitable stuff, he's also inspired multiple generations of children and teens with his TV shows, stand-up routines, and movies.

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  34. I try to separate the artist and the art from the person. I disapprove of Woody Allen's behavior. Marrying a girl who had grown up with him as a father figure goes too far. Although Dylan maintains he molested her, he was not convicted. I think famous people quite often get away with things that would send the rest of us to jail. But I still think Manhattan and Annie Hall and Midnight In Paris are brilliant movies. That doesn't mean I think Woody Allen is a great guy. Whether he's forgiven is between Woody and God. It has nothing to do with me. Sometimes art transcends personal actions. Of course, we each have to define art for ourselves. I do not see Mel Gibson as an artist. When The Passion of the Christ (I hope that's the correct title) was released, all my friends said, You HAVE to see this movie. I said, No, I don't. Mel Gibson made a fortune from action movies that are filled with profanity. He treats people horribly. I will not put another dime in his pocket. Mel Gibson also does not need my forgiveness, and he doesn't need my money.

    Love,
    Janie

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    1. I think the Gibson/Schwarzenegger/Stallone ship sailed in the 90s, but when they were on top, they rode it for all it was worth. They were like three business power players who had been handed all the power and money and got way carried away with it.

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  35. Aw, man! I did not know this about Woody Allen. Yuck, next time we're watching Toy Story(a huge fav at my house), I'm going to be thinking about this. So horrible! And yes, fame does seem to make wrong doing just go away... It's sad.

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    1. Oh, wait- that's Tim Allen who is Buzz in Toy Story!! Shew, I feel so much better! =) Lol!

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    2. Yeah I think Tim Allen is clean. Well, except for that DUI arrest in 1997. And the two years he served in jail in the late 70s/early 80s... (I Googled...I knew there was something in his past but I couldn't remember what it was!)

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    3. I think he had a drug conviction.

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  36. UGH. We suck sometimes, don't we??? I have to admit that I forgot about the allegations against Bill Cosby. But I refuse to support Mel Gibson and Woody Allen - and I guess now Stephen Collins, too. Sigh. We need to be less forgiving. It sounds like the NFL, too.

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    1. Yeah, I think Stephen Collins is doomed! That was the one I assumed everyone knew about. I guess I just knew because it popped up on Facebook the day it came out as a trending item.

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  37. You are so right.
    And do not forget athletes too!

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    1. Athletes are always in trouble! I'm not a sports fan, so I usually only hear of the ones who have done something wrong.

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  38. Sorry but people have done worse than Mel Gibson. Stephen C. is going to be in the dumps for a while but he might recover. Bill Cosby did an excellent cover up if those accusations are true. Woody Allen is married to the person he was accused of assaulting. If it's true then she needs a lot of help as well. Sad that people can use money to get away with things but the proof is in the pudding and with so many false allegations out there people need loads of proof these days.

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    1. Woody Allen just looks like one of those crazy guys who lives in an apartment alone with a bunch of cats! I guess people have done worse than Mel Gibson, but (allegedly) hitting his wife while she was holding their baby, then unleashing verbal abuse on her filled with racist comments is bad enough to turn me away.

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  39. I really have a problem with people who can use their fame and fortune to get above the law. I've seen it here at my university with the football team getting out of multiple rape charges and it boils my blood. I try to stick to my guns when it comes to what I spend my money on, though sometimes I'll admit to not doing my research and going to see one of these guy's films.

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    1. It happened at a local university when I was young--a girl said she was raped in a stairwell by two football players...she dropped the charges the next day. Perhaps she'd made the whole thing up, but it seemed like someone had a talk with her in the 24 hours between the charges making news and her mysteriously dropping them...

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  40. Funny, I just wrote something similar about authors behaving badly. I used to love Angelina Jolie until she "stole" Brad from Jennifer. Of course Brad had a lot to do with it too, but that really made me feel differently about her.

    I've never liked Woody Allen or any of those other fools, but it took me a long time to forgive Hugh Grant. He seemed like such a nice guy! Guess we'd do well to remember that their public face is just a persona, which may or may not bear any resemblance to who they actually are. I was so shocked when River Phoenix died of a drug overdose, considering his squeaky clean image.

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    1. One thing i'll never get about Brad and Angelia is the double standard. Most people think Angelina's great, yet women like Amy Grant and LeAnn Rimes get a huge amount of worldwide hate for doing the same thing. I've even heard people say negative things about Jennifer Aniston, as if because it's Angelina Jolie, Brad should be excused because Angelina has the right to whatever man on Earth she wants because she's way beyond beautiful.

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  41. wow it's horrible, I didn't know about that.

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    1. Indeed. Thanks for visiting, Melliane!

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  42. Hi Stephanie, innocent until proven guilty is correct – but once proven guilty then it’s not OK.
    Did you read about Judy Finnigan talking about a convicted rapist footballer saying he should be allowed to return to his club because the victim was drunk, and the rape was unpleasant but not violent? Things will never improve while people still hold those kinds of attitudes.

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    1. First--I've always thought it's awesome that English people call them footballers. I wish we called our football players that! What shocks me most about that story is that a WOMAN said that. It's obviously someone who has never been raped and never had anyone close to her go through it. There aren't varying degrees of rape. "He just raped her a little bit. It's okay." HUH?! I was reading a blog about Bill Cosby while researching this blog and dared to read the comments (bad idea). They were overwhelmingly in favor of Bill Cosby, no lie. The general tone was, "Women make this stuff up all the time...especially about rich and famous people. I don't believe it." I can see how that's true but anyone who really researches it will realize this isn't a case like that...it's far easier to just hear the story and dismiss it and go on believing what we want, though, I guess. I felt like perhaps if I got the story out there a little, it might help give at least a little justice to all those victims.

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  43. I hate that so matter actors continue to make money after doing such horrendous things. It sickens me! I heard about the Stephen Collins thing, and I can't STAND Mel Gibson. I'm sure Woody Allen's faux pas was all over gossip mags, but I somehow managed to forget about it. Urgh! Thanks for the reminder. ;)

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    1. After the Stephen Collins story broke, experts were saying it's unlikely he'll work again ever because children were involved. We're actually a LOT harder on people who abuse children and dogs than we are adults. I find that people should perhaps look into that. Why do we value even dogs over adult humans?

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  44. Great topic! I think that the public has a very short memory when it comes to these types of things. Also, I noticed that most of the celebrities you mention are men, and the attitude that a lot of people may (secretly) have is "Well, they're just being men." I think the public is probably a lot less forgiving of women. But as long as these people are making other people a lot of money, things will continue to be swept under the rug.

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    1. It's interesting--I see that in the way people react when men have affairs. We always blame the other woman and when you really boil it down, the underlying attitude is, "Men can't help themselves. It's women's responsibility to not tempt them." I've also seen a lot of blame thrown on Mel Gibson's ex for his behavior and Barbara Walters' dismissal of Sean Connery's behavior in the video as, "We've never heard his wife complain" is REALLY insulting, I think. Men do have brains and self-control and you're right, society basically dismissing their behavior is actually insulting to their entire gender. Although I will say we're very hard on women...just for much lesser offenses, like wearing revealing clothing or sleeping with a married man. Bill Cosby will always be a hero because people just refuse to believe it and that's okay. I just feel bad that his victims will always be dismissed because we like Bill Cosby too much to believe otherwise.

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  45. The answer to your question is: no, they shouldn't be working in their chosen field. At the end of the day, we, consumers, are the ones who keep them there. You missed Polanski, by the way. Same with Woody, Mel et al, Polanski should have been convicted of rape. I have a confession to make. I am a Woody Allen fan, but if he stopped making movies tomorrow (and it's been a long time since I liked one of his films, he's been on a downward spiral for a long time) it wouldn't affect me. I like his old stuff, that's all.

    Great post. Really, really good.

    Greetings from London.

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    1. I didn't know Woody Allen's work had been on a downward spiral! I'm so out of touch with what's good/bad in movies anymore. And yes, we are the ones that keep them working. But you can tell from reading the comments that many people have no intention of boycotting some or all of these people and I really do think that's the mass opinion on it. Bill Cosby's saving grace is that all of it came out after his career had already would down. All it's doing now is possibly hurting his comeback...but I have a feeling even without all of this, a Bill Cosby sitcom would have met the same fate as Robin Williams' did. You can't revive the 80s, even as great as that decade was! It's just...over.

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  46. This is why I don't do much to line the pockets of celebs. The industry is full of sick people and this sick world is willing to overlook it for 'the greater good of art'.

    That's a quote from my one college art prof. Her take was that it was OK because one needed scandal 'to bring out the true essence of art'. Patheticness.

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    1. Wow...very deep. And true, I suppose. A lot of the most famous authors suffered from alcoholism/substance abuse over the years. I was surprised to hear Stephen King admit that some of his best works were written while he was under the influence. I think once you reach that level of fame, there's a pressure and whatever a person's addiction is, giving into it provides some sort of escape?

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  47. very interesting post and it's something I find fascinating--as someone admittedly obsessed with celeb culture (more because I can't quite grasp it than because I'm enamored with celebs) I am instantly disgusted when they do these things. Last week I was going through a bunch of old VHS tapes, CDs and DVDs and when I came across a Woody Allen set (gift from a friend--I was never a fan) I instantly chucked it. I used to love 7th Heaven but I'd never watch it again now. I also think, in some cases, if the issue can be taken more personally maybe someone will have an angrier reaction. I'm Jewish so I have a pretty deep hate for Mel Gibson, Guy Fieri from the food network (his comments didn't get a ton of press) and Halle Berry after she made a pretty obnoxious comment on Leno some years back (again, most people brushed past it) and this week when Nikki Minaj released that video glorifying nazism I immediately deleted her songs off my iPod. I know a TON of people who feel it's okay to separate the crazy person from the art, but I just can't do that.

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    1. It's amazing to me that more people aren't outraged by Mel Gibson's comments about Jewish people. I will say that when someone shows prejudice against one race/religion, there are likely MANY other prejudices that come with it. During his rants, he used the N word multiple times. Jesse Jackson called it a "fundamental character flaw," and I think that's the best way to look at it. This behavior--this CONSTANT anger over people for no reason whatsoever--is only hurting them. As for Halle Berry--the fact that she hit a woman with her car, left the scene of the accident, then claimed the injury to her head made her forget what she'd done says a lot about her character, too. These people always have their own Olivia Pope to come along and clean up their messes, so they feel free to make them.

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  48. Yesterday I didn't have time to repeat the comment that Blogger ate, so let me see if I can now reconstruct it...

    The thing about celebrity, at least the celebrity of those who actively pursue it, is that at some point these people want to be noticed. That doesn't make them particularly virtuous. In fact, in most cases it's the opposite.

    But they have public personas, so they learn how to hide their darker natures.

    There was a bit more, but I forget what I said. I think that was the gist, anyway.

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    1. I agree completely. Another Bill Murray quote was something like, after you become famous you get about a year to be a butthole before it sticks for life. I think he was referring to Chevy Chase, whose buttholery stuck. I guess all that attention can turn you into a monster if you don't contain it, even IF you're a good person who doesn't really understand what that being a celebrity means until it's too late...

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  49. I know everyone doesn't feel the same way about it but, they do loose my respect. I refuse to watch anything with people like that in them. I don't condone what they do to woman and I won't support them by watching their movies, comedies, commercials, whatever.

    I had no idea about Bill Cosby though, that makes me really sad. :(

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    1. I have a feeling avoiding Bill Cosby won't be so hard. His sitcom's on reruns on some channel but you have to know when and where to find it. I agree with you, though. I'm not going to pay to see any of their movies or put money in their pockets in any way.

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  50. I definitely think we are part of the problem, as you suggest. But I think there's a deeper problem of putting movie/tv stars and athletes on a pedestal and wanting to hear every detail of their lives to either make us feel better that we aren't like them or so we can ignore the problems in our own lives. The first step is to put our dollars to good use and support only the people and products who also follow our ideals.

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  51. Oh, I definitely have my limits. I do think people can change and deserve a second chance, but I just can't with most of these. I'd never heard this about Sean Connery until this post, but as to the others, I was aware and have spent my entertainment dollars accordingly. Stephen Collins, Bill Cosby, Woody Allen, Mel Gibson, Chris Brown (not mentioned here, but worth noting)...I would not spend a dime to support any project of theirs. NOT. A. DIME. I felt the same way about Michael Jackson and the way people still idolized him in spite of many stories of how he abused children. *shiver* No thanks. I can add Sean Connery to that now as well.

    I used to *love* Bill Cosby and I've seen him live several times. I used to really respect him. Never, ever again. NO WAY. --Lisa

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  52. I personally have my limits. I will support someone until they do something to lose that support. I don't like when celebrities get away with things that they shouldn't just because they have money and influence. When there is proof- we need to let the proof speak for itself.

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  53. ohhhh snap and amen! it's pretty disgusting, isn't it? PS looks like Woody's "wife" is miserable in that picture...

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  54. Interesting that the examples you offer here are all male. What troubles me are stories about female celebrities who commit offenses much more minor than the ones you list here (nothing in the areas of child abuse or sexual assault), and the public ruthlessly knocks them down and then celebrates their fall from grace.

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  55. Like others I wasn't aware of Sean Connery's behavior and it certainly changes my opinion of him. I was aware of Bill Cosby and of Mel Gibson and you couldn't pay me to watch either of them anymore. It seam just as wrong to support them as they are in their behavior. and then there are the politicians!

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